Tuesday, December 2, 2008

Stearns Coffee fire

Stearns caught on fire but didn't burn down around 5am yesterday. Daniel says he plans to re-open in 2 weeks. That will be a busy 2 weeks. read more

In other news, how did the bike committee meeting(tomorrow) go if you're on it? What is the plan for Thursday?


Anonymous said...

Stearn's coffee will be in our prayers to JA, but not in our cups. I'd rather have it in my belly!

Reverend JJ Smoka

bikesr4whities said...

So sorry about stearns.

Read your link. What was the dead cyclists "high rate of speed," 12 mph?? I guess cares can hit fast cyclists, that sounds fair.

I haven't heard of nearly the same actions/reactions to his death as Sarah's? Gee, do you think it is because he was BLACK???? His , family, friends, kids, grandkids, wife etc couldn't possibly have grieved as hard as a bunch of co-students at UAH did for Sarah. Seriously, Sarah's death was tragic, but why is Horace's any less? Is there is ghost bike, maybe I went by too soon, when is the protest at city hall? Oh yeah, he was AFRICAN-AMERICAN. I get it.

Anonymous said...

What would you be protesting? Sure you can go to city council and talk about the tragedy, and it would be great if someone could get in touch with the family, to see if they need help with anything. Maybe you could help organize that.
If you want to put a ghost bike up, DO IT!!! Sounds like a great idea. And if you want to hype it up, write a story to the paper. Everyone has to do a little bit of work themselves for any results to happen, not just bitch about it.
There is a bicycle meeting with city council tomorrow. This was planned BEFORE the accident. I'm sure this topic will be brought up, and we can talk about the ghost bike, fundraisers for the family, newspapers etc.

clintpatty said...

Yeah pull the race card when it's not relevant. I didn't know the guy was black. I knew what color Sarah was before she was on the news because I knew her. So did other people here, so you can expect to hear more from us when it's someone we knew.

I don't know why he hasn't been on the news at all and Sarah was. But the accident reports look a lot different on his wreck than Sarah's. It was clearly an inattentive motorist's fault for hitting her from behind. If you take the accident report at face value, and it does not say the same thing as the link, then it wasn't the motorists fault at all. The motorist was just there to run into like a building. We can't complain as much about wrecks that are cyclists' fault, and the city can't do as much to prevent them. And we aren't yet sure if this was one of those or not. But we do feel sorry for his family either way.

racistseatpoo said...

They blamed Sarah at first too, forgot? Reports said she veered in front of the SUV and no way to avoid accident. Her fault. Yet ghost bike went up, meetings planned, she was dead regardless of blame.

Now, yoy choose to wait until someone decides for you whether Horace's life is worth any effort on your part. Yes, I call that racist, not just lazy or insensitive. Or maybe you are just bored of the this whole dead cyclist thing.

racistseatpoodoyou? said...

Pattywhack I meant to:

a) ask if you are the designated devil's advocate after reading back on your posts. Someone has to do it, maybe that is your role not you.

b) FYI the expression "using he race card" is a racist expression meant to staunch /put down anyone who dares question whether race played any role. Often, the users o such expressions are racists or just thoughtless.

c) Any African Americans on that bike committee? or any other people of color (other than whitish)? Why is that?

d) Is your estimate of participants racial or ethnic identity close to the city's population in the local bike clubs? polo? CM? alley cat? or other biking events?

clintpatty said...

Yeah they indicated blame on the first news articles for both Sarah and Horace. But the police report for Sarah indicated no blame for her, and that is not the case for the police report on Horace. We started calling the police on telling reporters that he was flying down the hill and therefore indicating blame before we heard about the report that said he was trying to turn too fast and just ran into the stationary van. His life is worth effort on our part, but we're not going to blame the city if it was mostly his fault. We don't know. It's sad when a cyclist dies even if it was his fault.

Yeah, I often post as devil's advocate here, especially on political issues. My deal with that is more to try to encourage people to expand how they think about the issues and not just consider something right because that's what Democrats say. It's not so much that I'm a Republican.

I don't consider the phrase playing the race card racist. It may be insensitive or thoughtless. But if race was not an issue in this accident or the reaction to it, you're a racist for claiming that it was.

No, there are no African Americans on the bike committee. Where are the African American cyclists? The only ones I personally know are homeless. I've seen 1 at the SCCC century and 1 at A&M and 2 at UAH. That's it. I see Asians at UAH and mostly not anywhere on the road. The local cycling clubs, road and mountain, are mostly white folks. When I see a fellow cyclist on the road, the number of times that it isn't a white folk is statistically insignificant. The reason black people aren't more involved in the committee or cycling clubs is because not as many of them ride, don't ride on the road, or choose to not get involved with the clubs or advocacy. It's not because we don't like black people.

racistseatpoo said...

I agree, Devil's Advocates often prompt people to think beyond labels.

I thought the Bike Committee thing was two-fold: a) educate motorists, the old Share the Road line, and b) to educate cyclists. If that were true, then the question about what would I protest at city council would be answered by the failures of the bike committee, the city, and the public. If Horace were riding without lights in the dark on the streets and did hit a parked/stopped car, then it is he who should have been educated on cycling safety. Wasn't the program promoted as two-fold?

I was under the impression that ghost bike memorials, crosses, what have you were separate from blame or fault. Instead they were a sign that a cyclists died at that spot. Grieving, respect, + public awareness unconnected to fault. Horace is no less dead either way. I wasn't aware ghost bikes are only for those deemed innocent, worthy, legal, or capitalistically significant. Why do cyclists often marginalize cyclists not like them? Don't we all make mistakes or occasionally brake some law, just as we do in our cars at times?

I see a lot of non-caucasiod bike riders who are not homeless. Lots of the bikes in the projects and lower income neighborhoods. These people often ride their bikes to work. In my mind, that makes them commuters too. I would argue that homeless riders would benefit from education and safety measures too.

My non-white friends did not enjoy their experiences with SCCC and did not feel comfortable in that group. Very few people enjoy being a token, either in reality or use. How no idea if non-whites have participated in or made aware of the other events. Something to think about or not, I guess.

UAH now has a cycling team or club or some sort, too bad Oakwood and AAMU don't. Yes, I think non-whites should be represented on the bike committee. Bicycle riders come in all shapes, sizes, colors, beliefs, memberships, etc. Just people prefer different styles and types of bicycles.

A comprehensive plan should truly be comprehensive, representing the community at large and the entire group not just certain more visible &/or louder factions, IMHO.

clintpatty said...

Then that is a good thing to promote tomorrow. Overall, we were not pleased with Mayor Spencer's seeming efforts to educate cyclists, which seemed more like placing blame on us for how we dress. Also, we are not killing any motorists or pedestrians. I think education efforts on cyclists will not be received so well, but hopefully that is not the case. I try to help educate the homeless cyclists of all races that I work with.

I wasn't referring to the ghost bike when I was talking about responsibility for the accident. I was talking about activism. I did not put the ghost bike up for Sarah, so I can't speak on that. I would not be surprised if the person who did also knew her. As far as I know, no one who regularly posts here knew Horace. And I wasn't trying to marginalize him.

I probably help fix some of the bikes of those riders who are not homeless but are pretty poor, and I try to educate them about safe riding too. Homeless riders would benefit, and they are probably a large proportion of the bike riders in the city, but I don't think anyone expressed an interest in having a homeless person on a committee with the city. 'jimbob' who posts here was considered for that to represent them, but I don't know if he is on the committee, but he is not as marginalized, has a job and home, is a registered voter, etc. Anyway, those riders you mentioned are commuters and their views should be heard. We don't know them though. I think I speak for everyone who regularly posts here on that. So we welcome new people, and hopefully the city wouldn't mind expanding the committee. And if they do you can still give your input. I give my input, but I'm not on the committee. It takes extra effort to make sure that the most vocal factions are not over-represented since they're heard more, especially with the under-heard groups like we've talked about.

UAH has a cycling club because an interested student started one. As far as I can tell, I'm the student at AAMU most interested in cycling. There aren't even bike racks all around campus here, much less plenty of people interested in being in a cycling club.

There is a wide variety of views among the white folk on SCCC here. I'm not so against them. It's probably more common for people there to marginalize others or be elitist regardless of race, as that is a tradition with racing, but there are a variety of non-racers in SCCC also.

iseewhatyoudidthere said...


That bike committee was only recently implemented and has no overarching authority or real funding, for that matter. Seriously, if you want to biatch about it, then why not get yourself a seat on it so you can champion the rest of the cycling community that is not SCCC. Really. Go do it and stop whining.

News Flash: There is no committee for erecting ghost bikes. If you feel so inclined, go put one up, or organize with some other people to do it together. Don't cry racist at the whole cycling community when there's no singular person or entity that participates in those displays.

wow, your rant sounds familiar! sccc vendetta, opportunistic aliased postings, "the bike committee sux cuz it's got spring city folk/sux cuz i'm not on it", everyone who does not join my anti sccc crusade is a bully and/or a racist.

///what you did there. i see it.

Da Milkman said...

Yeah, It sounds to me like some people need to have their dick held when they pee. I'm real happy you have a voice and I'm proud that you feel free enough to come to this venue and cry us all a river, but you'll find no tolerance for racist goading and baby complaints. The bike committee doesn't do anything? Well what are you doing? I'm not on the committee, but I'm a cyclist and I do shit on my own. Things that HELP other cyclists. ALL TYPES OF OTHER CYCLISTS. What's more disturbing is that I'm certain that your a smart person, but your insidious racist ideology's are pathetic and embarrassing. It makes you out to be nothing more than a fool that needs to learn how to check himself. We, as a cycling community, do what we can. If someone is harmed on the streets, then live or dead we have their backs. However, I'm not ready to fire bomb city hall for a man who rides at dusk without lights and runs into what may as well been a fucking barn.
And just so your all clear on this "bikesr4white"s", Sarah WASN'T white either shithead!

I'm say this because I love you,

urfacadeisclear said...

HAHAHAHA. What was Horace's ethnicity? Obama is more white than black but deemed black. Who is to say what race anyone is?

Oh no, you saw/found where I hid you guys' "magic potion" or the ghost bike painted black? The "Easter Egg" I left for just you? Your union card? The counterfit 1099s? Your paranoia meds?

You're missing lots of facts not to mention marbles, whitie tightie. The pathos is in all your brain & so is your altered reality.

iseewhatyoudidthere said...

wtf are you talking about?
You don't make any sense.

By calling someone else racist and paranoid, then slapping them with a racial slur... hmmmm... what does that make YOU?

/YOUR facade is clear.
//no one here is a racist

Anonymous said...

So, eh um how about that Stearns fire eh?

Any news?